Analysis of Matsya Avatar & Noahs Ark 4,000 years ago

[KALKI]

BASED ON BIBLICAL SOURCES ALONE, MY ANALYSIS OF THE GREAT FLOOD...HOW DOES MATSYA FIT INTO ALL THIS??

(requested by few, feel free to share)

Matsya is described to have rescued the first man, Manu, from the great floods!

This is similar to the biblical story of Noahs ark.

Obviously Manu's Vedic version happen long before Christianity existed.

The aim of this post is to study the time scales.

First we will examine biblical sources, later vedic.

When I have time I will create these into slides.

__________________________________________________

KEY POINTS:

• Jesus was born 2,000 years ago
• Biblical sources claim the world is: 6010 years old (see below for "Method Two")
• Science states: World is: 4.5 billion years old
• Vedas state: World is: 4.32 billion years old

Humans Populated the Entire World. After more than 1600 years of habitation on Earth, the planet's population was surely large (millions or billions). The Bible confirms that (a) Man had multiplied upon the face of the Earth (Genesis 6:1), (b) Violence and corruption filled the Earth (Genesis 6:11-12). The Bible is clear that man could not have existed only in the Mesopotamian region—a region too small to support such a large population, especially considering the natural dispersion affect of a violent society.



COMPLETE BREAK DOWN:

*KEY POINTS:
Jesus was born 2,000 years ago
Biblical sources conclude world: 6,010 years old
Science states: World is: 4.5 billion years old
Vedas state: World is: 4.32 billion years old
Man had multiplied upon the face of the Earth (Genesis 6:1) http://biblehub.com/genesis/6-1.htm (b) Violence and corruption filled the Earth (Genesis 6:11-12).

According to Genesis (before the great floods) life existed on earth for 1,600 years! (not possible!) Life existed in India, Greece, Egypt, China &South Korea!
Flood began: Approximately 4,359 years ago!

"Look! I am about to cover the earth with a flood that will destroy every living thing that breathes. Everything on earth will die." Genesis 6:9-8:22 http://biblehub.com/genesis/6-9.htm
http://biblehub.com/genesis/8-12.htm*

TIMESCALES:
1.Adam (first man) lived 930 years (Genesis 5:5) http://biblehub.com/genesis/5-5.htm
died 216 yrs. Before the birth of Noah

2.Seth = Adam's 3rd son lived 912 years
Seth knew Noah for 34 years before he died

3.Methuselah (4th great grandson of Seth) lived 969 years
Methuselah knew Adam 243 years. Methuselah knew Seth 355 years

4.Lamech (son of Methuselah) lived 777 years (died before his father)*
he is the father of Noah died 5 years before the flood. Lamech died: 2110 BCE (Genesis 5:29) Noah named by his father: http://biblehub.com/genesis/5-29.htm

5.Noah lived 950 years (Genesis 9:29) http://biblehub.com/genesis/9-29.htm
Methuselah knew Noah 600 years and died the year of the flood
Talked with his father, Lamech 595 years
Shem son of Noah (father of all Semites) lived 600 years
talked with Methuselah 98 years* lived after the flood 502 years

7.Eber or Heber (great-grandson of Shem) lived 464 years
knew both Noah and Shem

8.Terah (3 x great grandson of Eber) lived 205 years
130 yrs old when Abraham is born. Talked with both Noah and Shem

9.Abraham (Abram son of Terah) lived 175 years
Abraham knew Shem son of Noah 150 years
Noah died 2 yrs. before Abraham was born
Heber outlives Abraham by 4 years

10.Isaac (son of Abraham and Sarah) lived 180 years. Knew Shem (son of Noah) 50 years

11.Jacob (called Israel and son of Isaac and father of the 12 tribes) . Lived 147 years. Knew Abraham 20 years

12.Levi (3rd oldest son of Israel – Jacob) Knew Isaac about 45 years
*knew Amran father of Moses who was his grandson.
Great grandfather of Moses
Levi passed on the oral history to his grandson Amran

13.Moses (son of Amran son of Kohath son of Levi) Lived 120 years
Brother of Aaron who knew their father approx. 65 years
Moses receives the Oral Tradition from God and is commanded to write the first 5 books of the Old Testament."And Moses was an hundred and twenty years old when he died: his eye was not dim, nor his natural force abated." (Deuteronomy 34:7) http://biblehub.com/deuteronomy/34-7.htm
Moses lived: 1393-1273 BCE***

Moses existence (confirmation):
14. Joshua lived: 1356-1245 BCE (Joshua 1:1) http://biblehub.com/joshua/1-1.htm | Joshua lived to be 110 years old (Joshua 24:29) http://biblehub.com/joshua/24-29.htm (6th century BCE)

"Now after the death of Moses the servant of the LORD it came to pass, that the LORD spake unto Joshua the son of Nun, Moses' minister, saying,"
15. "Sometime after Joshua had died, the Israelis asked the LORD, "Who is to lead us against the Canaanites in our opening attack against them?" http://biblehub.com/judges/1-1.htm 8th century BCE

Followed by: Ruth, Samuel , Saul , David , Solomon 970–931*BCE | Rehoboam (son of Solomon) 931 - 913 BCE | Abijah of Judah (son of Rehoboam) 911 BC


METHOD TWO:

Another way to go about this is by adding the generation gap between Adam and Noah, which many people tend to do.

1. Adam 930 lived years
2. Seth 912 lived years
3. Enosh 905 lived years
4. Cainan 910 lived years
5. Mahalalel 895 lived years
6. Jared 962 lived years
7. Enoch 365 lived years
8. Methuselah 969 lived years
9. Lamech 777 (Noahs father) lived years
10. Noah 950 lived years

If we take the above figures (at face value) we reach a figure of: 8,575

E.G. 930 + 912 + 905 + 910 + 895 + 962 + 365 + 969 +777 + 950 = 8,575 years

What does this mean?

Seth for example, Adam's 3rd son lived 912 years
Seth knew Noah for 34 years before he died

.Methuselah (4th great grandson of Seth) lived 969 years
Methuselah knew Adam 243 years. Methuselah knew Seth 355 years

WE DO NOT COUNT THE AGE OF SETH AND MANY OTHERS.

For example:

If a father has 6 sons, and each son died aged 56

6 (sons) x 56 = 336

Did the father live to be 336? No.

An apologist will count every offspring (for each generation) to reach a figure of 8,000 or so.

This would place Adam on earth around 9,000 max or so.

Identify key players only.


HINDUISM = MATSYA AVATAR:

This portion is straight forward, no need to dig into scriptures or timelines..Regardless, I have added a few verses below.

• Satyayug or Krityug = 17,28,000 human years
• Tretayug = 12,96,000 human years
• Dwaparyug = 8,64,000 human years
• Kaliyug = 4,32,000 human years

Many will say: Noahs ark and Matsya avatar share and came from the same source...(hit that pause button!) Hinduism is far older.

Kaliyug began right after the end of the Mahabharat war with King Parikshit (son of Abhimanyu and Uttara) as the new ruler (5,000 years ago).

Matsya avatar took place in Satya yuga. This is where the legend originates. Now, whether you decide to call it a myth or not, the fact remains..The legend is far older.

If "Satya yuga" was 17,28,000 human years in length. then simple common sense dictates "Noah" did not exist at this point Nor is Adam that old.

Again, without any scriptural verses , by simply qutoing the 4 yugas, this refutes any line of questioning.

The 4 yugas are heavily mentioned throughout (almost) every major vedic text, including the Bhagavad Gita.

"By human calculation, a thousand ages taken together is the duration of Brahma's one day. And such also is the duration of his night"

https://asitis.com/8/17.html

PURPORT

The duration of the material universe is limited. It is manifested in cycles of kalpas. A kalpa is a day of Brahma, and one day of Brahma consists of a thousand cycles of four yugas or ages: Satya, Treta, Dvapara, and Kali. The cycle of Satya is characterized by virtue, wisdom and religion, there being practically no ignorance and vice, and the yuga lasts 1,728,000 years. In the Treta-yuga vice is introduced, and this yuga lasts 1,296,000 years. In the Dvapara-yuga there is an even greater decline in virtue and religion, vice increasing, and this yuga lasts 864,000 years. And finally in Kali-yuga (the yuga we have now been experiencing over the past 5,000 years) there is an abundance of strife, ignorance, irreligion and vice, true virtue being practically nonexistent, and this yuga lasts 432,000 years. In Kali-yuga vice increases to such a point that at the termination of the yuga the Supreme Lord Himself appears as the Kalki avatara, vanquishes the demons, saves His devotees, and commences another Satya-yuga. Then the process is set rolling again. These four yugas, rotating a thousand times, comprise one day of Brahma, the creator god, and the same number comprise one night. Brahma lives one hundred of such "years" and then dies. These "hundred years" by earth calculations total to 311 trillion and 40 million earth years. By these calculations the life of Brahma seems fantastic and interminable, but from the viewpoint of eternity it is as brief as a lightning flash. In the causal ocean there are innumerable Brahmas rising and disappearing like bubbles in the Atlantic. Brahma and his creation are all part of the material universe, and therefore they are in constant flux.

Secondary translation:

BG 8.17: One day of Brahma (kalp) lasts a thousand cycles of the four ages (mahā yug) and his night also extends for the same span of time. The wise who know this understand the reality about day and night.

https://www.holy-bhagavad-gita.org/chapter/8/verse/17


Srimad Bhagavatam:

"At the end of every four yugas, the great saintly persons, upon seeing that the eternal occupational duties of mankind have been misused, reestablish the principles of religion."

https://vedabase.io/en/library/sb/8/14/4/

PURPORT

In this verse, the words dharmaḥ and sanātanaḥ are very important. Sanātana means “eternal,” and dharma means “occupational duties.” From Satya-yuga to Kali-yuga, the principles of religion and occupational duty gradually deteriorate. In Satya-yuga, the religious principles are observed in full, without deviation. In Tretā-yuga, however, these principles are somewhat neglected, and only three fourths of the religious duties continue. In Dvāpara-yuga only half of the religious principles continue, and in Kali-yuga only one fourth of the religious principles, which gradually disappear. At the end of Kali-yuga, the principles of religion, or the occupational duties of humanity, are almost lost. Indeed, in this Kali-yuga we have passed through only five thousand years, yet the decline of sanātana-dharma is very prominent. The duty of saintly persons, therefore, is to take up seriously the cause of sanātana-dharma and try to reestablish it for the benefit of the entire human society.

Matsya, the Lord’s Fish Incarnation



This sums up the topic...I may have forgotten to add a few things here and there..If you dig around or go deeper you'll reach the same results.

[MonsoonLady]

Originally Posted by Asiansoul

Well researched post!!

If the ark was 4,000 years ago , would that explain the Harappan floods?

- Wright, Rita P. (2009). The Ancient Indus: Urbanism, Economy, and Society. Cambridge University Press. ISBN 978-0-521-57219-4. Retrieved 29 September 2013.

Harappan floods did not destroy the whole of India.

[Neha.Kulkarni]

Finally done it!!

Made my video from most of the notes

please shareeeeeee!!

#DavidWood #NoahsArk #Hinduism
Proud Hindu: 3 reasons why Christianity is false?

YouTube

[MsTee1985]

Hardly makes any sense

How did domestic cats and dogs evolve within a time span of 5,000 years?

[MsTee1985]

Originally Posted by Neha.Kulkarni

Finally done it!!

Made my video from most of the notes

please shareeeeeee!!

#DavidWood #NoahsArk #Hinduism
Proud Hindu: 3 reasons why Christianity is false?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnXH1yZrYZo&t=18s

Video is too long but fantastic!

I'm trying to share the notes

[Neha.Kulkarni]

Originally Posted by MsTee1985

Hardly makes any sense

How did domestic cats and dogs evolve within a time span of 5,000 years?

Here is a copy of my notes


i have read a Christian apologist book, where they explain that not every specie was required...For example, cats are descendants from lions , tigers...so their theory is, they took the primary source, which later evolved over time.. LoL.., now we know, that majority of species have evolved, mutaed over 1,000s of years to be what they are today...where as the floods happen 4,000 years ago..So a house cat evolving from a lion would not be possible in 3,000 years (38 species of cats on the planet)
I have a copy of the book, I will take a picture and upload it

The pantherlike ancestor to the cat family first appeared in Southeast Asia, about 10.8 million years ago. Prior to the use of DNA studies in cats, it was difficult to trace the Felidae family history, because feline fossils are rare, and difficult to tell apart.

In 1997, Warren E. Johnson and Stephen J. O’Brien performed DNA analyses of 37 living cat species, which allowed them to divide today’s cats into 8 lineages.

The great roaring cats (lions, leopards, jaguars, tigers) were the first to branch off, about 6.4 million years ago. The ancestor of modern domestic cats was the last to appear, about 3.4 million years ago. A small wildcat species was first domesticated in the Near East 8,000 to 10,000 years ago.

As sea levels rose and fell, cats migrated to new continents and developed new species. It is estimated that cats migrated to North America from Asia across the Bering land bridge connecting Siberia and Alaska about 9 million years ago. Later, several American cat lineages returned to Asia. With each migration, the cats evolved further and changed into an ever-growing array of sizes and types of felines. Based on the DNA and fossil evidence, the Johnnson-O’Brien team was able to demonstrate a series of at least 10 intercontinental migrations of cats over the past 10 million years, in which cat were able to colonize the world.

Written by Tiffany Lennox, DVM

References:
Scientific American 297, 68-75 (2007)

https://www.killarneycat.com/the-evo...%20years%20ago.

[---RuFfEdGe---]

That was explained good!

I found the video easy to follow but the writing for some of the books was unclear
if you have the pdf or screens please upload them

[MonsoonLady]

So how long ago was the Matsya avataar? You still have not said

[Neha.Kulkarni]

Originally Posted by MonsoonLady

So how long ago was the Matsya avataar? You still have not said

I've only read this now..I was searching for this thread to pass the link onto someone I was discussing Adams age...I will post my notes here....I used method two as Kal suggested:

The 4 time cycles, in Hinduism (which you should already know from ) are:

Satya 1,728,000
Treta 1,296,000
Dvapara 864,000
Kalyuga 432,000

Matsya avatar took place in Satya Yuga , which is 1,728,000 years ago ..Now compare that to "4,000" years ago.

Noahs ark took place 4,000 years ago.

There is no comparison. Its is possible for life to evolve from Satya yuga but not when Noah or Adam walked the earth 4,000 or 8,000 years ago..It is basic common sense.

So, if someone says Hinduism also contains the great floods , first they need to understand the 4 time cycles.

We are currently living in Kalyug.

I will make a second video of this, to break down the first 10 generations of Adam and the 4 yugas.

[Inthemix]

Originally Posted by Asiansoul

Well researched post!!

If the ark was 4,000 years ago , would that explain the Harappan floods?

- Wright, Rita P. (2009). The Ancient Indus: Urbanism, Economy, and Society. Cambridge University Press. ISBN 978-0-521-57219-4. Retrieved 29 September 2013.

Harappan floods is nothing but guess work

Was there a war?
Some historians believed the Indus civilisation was destroyed in a large war. Hindu poems called the Rig Veda (from around 1500 BC) describe northern invaders conquering the Indus Valley cities.

In the 1940s, archaeologist Mortimer Wheeler discovered 39 human skeletons at Mohenjo-Daro. He believed that they were people killed by invaders.

Archaeologists now think this is not true. There is no evidence of war or mass killings. Indus Valley people seem to have been peaceful. If they had an army, they have left few signs of weapons or battles.

It's more likely that the cities collapsed after natural disasters. Enemies might have moved in afterwards.

Source for the above: https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/topic...ticles/z8b987h


Vedas are not 1500 BC
How can Vedas be 1500BC WHEN Mahabharat and the Bhagavad Gita is 5,000 years old?

[Desi_0_0_Doll]

Originally Posted by Kalpana.v

This made so much sense. I was told Matsya avtaar took place the same time as Noahs ark (when I was 9 )

My brainwashed cousin from India told me Manu and Noah are the same...I was wth are you talking about? She got offended that I was trying to cause "communal disharmony"..

She said we are all the same , we pray to the same god

I thought...Yeh, right!!!

I told her: 3 gods from 3 religions want to throw us in hell for rejecting them and OUR god allows freedom of worship and Manus legend is much older..I felt sad she was defending something she has not even read